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Author Topic: Is the State inevitable?  (Read 3675 times)
wgreen
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« on: February 03, 2011, 01:49:13 PM »

I was thinking yesterday about private courts replacing statutory law and ran into this idea:  Suppose I am an egalitarian and believe it is unfair for some people to have more money than others, so I take my neighbor to court to try to get some of his cash.  What would determine the outcome?  Of course, the outcome would be determined by a judge, jury, or some similar arrangement.  But what if that jury also believed in egalitarianism?  Then the defendent would be forced to hand me the money or else suffer some consequences.  In fact, if the jury thought it would be OK to kill him if he did not fork over the cash, then he might even be killed.

My point is that a "State-like" (oppressive, coercive, violent) situation can arise without a formal State, if only the majority of the people abandon reason.

The question is, is such an oppressive condition inevitable?  Does it naturally arise periodically as cultures meander through various guiding philosophies?  Is it inhernet in human nature that there will always be a majority willing to plunder each other?

Any thoughts?
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Seth King
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« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2011, 07:13:06 PM »

To save time rewriting a response I'm just going to refer to an older article I wrote.

http://dailyanarchist.com/2010/07/29/what-rights-means-to-me/
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When are you moving to New Hampshire?
JustSayNoToStatism
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« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2011, 02:57:05 PM »

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so I take my neighbor to court to try to get some of his cash
As your neighbor, I wouldn't go anywhere near your "court."

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Of course, the outcome would be determined by a judge, jury, or some similar arrangement. 

As a consequence of my previous response, your judge would have no authority over me.

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Then the defendent would be forced to hand me the money or else suffer some consequences.
It is possible that in certain situations, people will steal from you, especially if you don't have any defense against them. Part of what makes someone an anarchist is understanding that this is always the reality. Someone might try to steal from you. You just have to consider whether you want that someone to be the monopoly master of violence...or not. At least in the situation you described you are allowed to try to resist. Now you can't.

In addition, I don't think that this company would last very long trying to loot other people. The costs of raiding people's houses would be too prohibitive, and even the most radical communists wouldn't be able or willing to part with the resources needed to keep this going.

So 1) It's not going to happen, because realistically, there are far too many obstacles...2) Even if it could, it's a risk I'm fine with, since it's better than the certainty I'll be stolen from now.

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The question is, is such an oppressive condition inevitable?  Does it naturally arise periodically as cultures meander through various guiding philosophies?  Is it inhernet in human nature that there will always be a majority willing to plunder each other?
Three questions, three answers
1) No, but it's likely there would be pockets of it for a long time, even if there was an anarchist revolution.
2) It has, but doesn't necessarily have to.
3. No. It's inherent that people are self-interested, but it's possible to have a society where self-interest is voluntarism.
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"I like to eat. Instead of a monarch I propose we have a Chef be final arbiter in matters. We'll call it anarcho-chefism."
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nhwulf
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« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2011, 11:31:35 PM »

 Those that would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither. Ben Franklin
 And yes, the state is inevitable so long as people find it possible to trade ones own freedom for anothers wealth. Eliminate this possibility and the state fails, liberty reigns.
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