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Author Topic: Land  (Read 11624 times)
rothbardgroupie
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« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2014, 07:53:20 AM »

  I also think it's good that if someone isn't making use of land, then they can't exclude others from it.

I think that view is full of problems.

I was talking about homesteading.  You think that's full of problems?
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Syock
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« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2014, 08:45:27 AM »

  I also think it's good that if someone isn't making use of land, then they can't exclude others from it.

I think that view is full of problems.

I was talking about homesteading.  You think that's full of problems?

When you are willing to violate contracts to do it, yes.
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rothbardgroupie
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« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2014, 05:06:20 PM »

  I also think it's good that if someone isn't making use of land, then they can't exclude others from it.

I think that view is full of problems.

I was talking about homesteading.  You think that's full of problems?


Did I specifically mention breaking contracts?  Are we having the same conversation? 

When you are willing to violate contracts to do it, yes.
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Syock
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« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2014, 05:15:47 PM »

Did I specifically mention breaking contracts?  Are we having the same conversation?  

You specifically said:

I also think it's good that if someone isn't making use of land, then they can't exclude others from it.

Making use of the land and owning the land are different things.  The concept of homesteading is full of funny perspectives that violate contracts stating ownership.  Being able to exclude others from land you own, regardless of your use, or lack thereof, is essential to the concept of private property.

You didn't get specific about all of that, but the general acceptance of homesteading includes such issues.  
« Last Edit: August 21, 2014, 01:33:57 AM by Syock » Logged

kunkmiester
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« Reply #19 on: August 21, 2014, 12:51:49 AM »

"Use" is also rather loaded in that case.  If I have land, and I leave some of it wild, that doesn't mean I'm not "using" it.  There are plenty of reasons to leave land wild, from attracting wildlife to arranging certain kinds of buffers--using wetlands for sewage treatment before discharge for example.  It may seem from a distance(both literal and figurative) that the land isn't being used, but it might well be.  If you drain my sewage swamp, I can probably seek reparations, but better to have a mechanism that keeps it from happening to begin with, right?
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rothbardgroupie
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« Reply #20 on: August 21, 2014, 05:21:54 AM »

Did I specifically mention breaking contracts?  Are we having the same conversation?  

You specifically said:

I also think it's good that if someone isn't making use of land, then they can't exclude others from it.

Making use of the land and owning the land are different things.  The concept of homesteading is full of funny perspectives that violate contracts stating ownership.  Being able to exclude others from land you own, regardless of your use, or lack thereof, is essential to the concept of private property.

You didn't get specific about all of that, but the general acceptance of homesteading includes such issues.  


Fair enough.  I was obviously unclear.  I was specifically referring to having to put something unused to use before you can claim ownership.  Abandonment versus absentee property norms are a related but separate issue, with little consensus amongst libertarians.  An interesting related article:

http://perbylund.com/academics_polsci_msc.pdf

As far as what's essential to the concept of private property, that's probably worth it's own thread.

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rothbardgroupie
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« Reply #21 on: August 21, 2014, 05:24:21 AM »

"Use" is also rather loaded in that case.  If I have land, and I leave some of it wild, that doesn't mean I'm not "using" it.  There are plenty of reasons to leave land wild, from attracting wildlife to arranging certain kinds of buffers--using wetlands for sewage treatment before discharge for example.  It may seem from a distance(both literal and figurative) that the land isn't being used, but it might well be.  If you drain my sewage swamp, I can probably seek reparations, but better to have a mechanism that keeps it from happening to begin with, right?


I agree, use is a loaded term.  If we'd had a free market in land for the past couple of hundred years (or longer), perhaps common law would have reduced some of the mystery.
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Syock
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« Reply #22 on: August 21, 2014, 07:02:01 AM »

As far as what's essential to the concept of private property, that's probably worth it's own thread.

There are probably a half dozen threads here on the issue. 
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MAM
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« Reply #23 on: September 14, 2014, 12:12:26 AM »

I figure there's gonna be some sort of public property.

Seems like rivers would be difficult to regulate with private property norms. I know there are models proposed still seems a little weird.
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kunkmiester
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« Reply #24 on: September 23, 2014, 09:42:23 PM »

Air at least is a natural commons.  Without sealing yourself into a capsule, you have to let it blow where it will, and distant events can have a substantial effect on someone's air quality.
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